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[[Category:{{{1}}}|Toriyama on DBGT]]

many have made the mistake that AT had nothing to do with GT. this would be wrong. here is the interview

http://www.thegrandline.com/dbzinfo/toriyamafinale.html

he checked the story, offered advice, did designs, the title, calls it a grand side story in his dragon box intro and said he loved/recommends it. so stfu about saying he hated itBroly Rocks 09:29, August 16, 2011 (UTC)

haters be pwned!Edit

in the butt!

Psst, he considers it a nice side story.

I just read the entire interview...if you can even call it that lol. Toriyama says that if he had the motivation to continue the Manga, he would do exactly what Toei did with GT. He said he loved the idea of Goku being a child, even though the majority of fans hate it. I wonder if the fans would have loved GT if it had stayed the same, but it would have been made by Toriyama instead. Goes to show that they only hate GT, because Toriyama, technically, didn't create it. So for the GT haters, take this into account. SuperGogeta91 (talk) 21:02, September 6, 2012 (UTC)

Underrated Edit

I think people exaggerate on how bad GT is. Personally, I don't think it's that bad. It's definitely not the best anime ever, but it's not the worst either. I think what should have been changed was the music (even though I'm a dub fan, really, that was waaaaaayyyy too industrial-sounding), it shouldn't have spent so much time in the city (most important fights took place in cities. Give us a colorful battleground, like Planet Namek or the Cell Games. Not those actual places, but interesting places like those) and the other characters should have gotten more glory (Gohan became a weakling, Goten became Master Roshi Junior, Piccolo was mostly irrelevant, and Krillin faded out of the series almost entirely). Had they fixed that, it would have been much better. But it wasn't as bad as so many people say. I actually really liked the Baby Saga. And I really think a lot of people just insult GT because you're considered weird if you like the series. Fatdude (talk) 22:30, September 6, 2012 (UTC)

DBGT!!!!! Edit

To be honest, ever since I first started watching DBGT years ago I always enjoyed it. Ending DBZ with Goku leaving to train Uub just did not do it for me, I was hoping a new series would come out to properly end the DB franchise. I thought the whole turning Goku back into a kid thing was a clever concept, it brought me back in the mind of his early Dragon Ball days. I enjoyed everything about GT, I can't complain at all, even the Lost Episodes (which I think is pretty funny). I also feel like the ending of GT is precisely what I wanted and needed to move on with my anime experience.

People hate GT for very SELFISH reasons! We're only fans, we can't have everything our fucking way. I hear shit like, 'this show should be called Dragon Ball Goku Time' or 'why is everybody else weak except Goku' and 'how can two andriod 17s become stronger than ssj4, gt sucks' oh and my favorite is 'why does Pan get so much screen time'

Shit like this angers me! I mean I've watched Dragon Ball and its entirety (including the movies) Dragon Ball Z and its entirety (including the movies) and Dragon Ball GT (including the movie) and peoples arguments are completely invalid. Goku has been everyone's go to guy for battle ever since he was 12 years ago, GT didn't change anything! He's the strongest! Point blank period. Pan got the most screen time because if you IDIOTS do research on GT it clearly states that Goku and Pan's relationship is the main focus for the series. Gohan, Goten, Trunks, Vegeta, Piccolo, etc don't need anymore character development, they had their shine in DBZ!!! I REPEAT, THEY DON'T NEED ANYMORE CHARACTER DEVELOPMENT!!! Gohan completely stops training after the Cell saga!!! Regardless of his "Ultimate" power, he never trains! So it's only logical that General Rildo whups his ass (he's stronger than Majin Buu). Goten & Trunks had their shine for a significant portion of the Buu saga, what more do we need to learn about them!!? Trunks is more mature in GT obviously, Goten is into girls now, SIMPLE!!! Piccolo has been outclassed in strength ever since the beginning of the Buu saga, so why would he fight Baby or Super 17?? To get his ass kicked too!!!??

Overall, I enjoyed GT! I think the concept of having the Dragon Balls themselves be Goku's last and ultimate test was genius! Also that Goku & Vegeta SSJ4 VS. Omega Shenron battle was intense & one of my favorites. SO FUCK THE GT HATERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Relax....Edit

Okay, first of all, I'm going to suggest "calm down..." :). If those exclamation points and overused Caps are any indication, then you need to take a deep breath and relax. It's like you're saying "Fuck the hate!!!! How will we accomplish that?? With more HATE!!!!!" You sound like that angry ginger kid on Youtube, coppercab ;).

Now honestly, myself, I'm not that fond of GT. I HAVE watched every minute of every episode, and it didn't shorten my lifespan or leave any lasting injury, but I really didn't enjoy it, mostly because the characters are mis-represented from what we know and love in DBZ. The animation makes them look wrong, their voices are different, and their actions don't follow what was already so firmly established. Talking about Vegeta mostly here, but all of them, Goten, Trunks, Gohan, especially Pan. She was really sweet at the end of DBZ. Anyway, I'm not going to bash the show, these are just the reasons I don't like it, if you like it then great :). I can only presume you enjoyed the new characters they introduced in GT, and I actually thought the stories weren't bad, even if they did absolutely nothing good with the first season (Giant talking space worms, giant space bees, Bon Para homosexuals, giant robot teddy bear. I remember when space was cool, with an evil overlord and his empire, and an army of unique and awesome aliens. Just saying, space in GT was pretty camp and childish in comparison)

But there's one fairly large correction I have to make.... Yes, in Dragonball, Goku does pretty much everything. It's a wide-spanning adventure and it's all about him, like Ash in Pokemon. However, you're totally incorrect to suggest this is the case in DBZ. A quick list:

1. Dies against Raditz (not really a victory considering Piccolo fired the shot)

2. Late returning from King Kai's training when the 6 Saibamen and Nappa were fighting (gave the others the spotlight throughout that fight)

3. Beats Nappa, fights Vegeta. Goku's body is wrecked after the Kaio-Ken, whereas Vegeta keeps coming. A combination of Yajirobe and Gohan actually do the relevant damage, and Vegeta is allowed to leave.

4. Recovering and travelling throughout the Namek saga, meaning that Cui, Dodoria, Zarbon, Guldo, Recoome and Frieza have to be fought completely without Goku. He arrives, beats Recoome and Burter, then gets beaten by Ginyu, and after getting his body back he has to recover again.

5. Piccolo and Vegeta fight Frieza. Yes Goku beats Frieza in the end, but until he transforms to Super Saiyan, Goku is outmatched. This is the only true victory over a main saga boss for Goku, just keep that in mind. And even then, it's not permanent....

6. Trunks has to clean up Goku's sloppy work, he kills Frieza for good.

7. Goku gets beaten by Android 20. Vegeta beats 20, and 17 kills Gero.

8. Goku is busy dying from a heart disaease, so Piccolo has to fuse with Kami and fight the Androids. Goku recovers, and then Vegeta and Trunks fight Semi-Perfect Cell. Goku eventually fights Cell in the Cell Games. What happens? He's too weak to beat him. Gohan steps in, and Goku eventually sacrifices himself for Earth. He's dead. Accomplishments? Sort-of beating Vegeta and sort-of killing Frieza. Nappa and Burter and Recoome hardly count as important victories. Gohan destroys Cell and the 7 Cell Jrs.

^Sorry to cut you off, but if you are seriously saying Goku has no accomplishments, you know absolutely NOTHING! about DB/Z/GT. Everyone looks like dogshit when you put it that way. Where would they all be if Goku hadn't stepped in, in the first place? Piccolo would die from Raditz and if Gohan never got angry enough to kill him, Raditz would probably sell him to Freeza or kill him. Earth is doomed and you got a shitty plot for the remainder of the series (IF it can continue for long). Without Goku your whole argument is crap, especially when you say "accomplishments?" as if though he did nothing.

Sorry, no, I didn't mean to give that impression, for a start he's the one who finds the ability to transform to Super Saiyan, he's the hope and inspiration for all who know him, his accomplishments simply from being the person he is outshine all others in DBZ. But I'm just making the point that he didn't win every fight single-handed, just because he's the most heroic, saviour-style character in the show, doesn't mean he's always the strongest, or that he wins every fight. There are others who accomplish things in the show as well. But there's no doubting Goku's character and influence, he's definitely the most important character in DBZ.

TrueCelt (talk) 17:16, September 15, 2012 (UTC)

9. Has a little sparring bout with Vegeta, actually reviving Buu (hardly commendable).

10. Has a little sparring bout with Fat Buu

11. Has to fuse with Vegeta to beat Buuhan. And when Kid Buu blows up Earth, Goku screws up, drops Gohan, Piccolo and the young boys, saves Hercule and his dog.

12. Fights Kid Buu. Too weak to beat him. Has to use a combination of a MASSIVE Spirit bomb, the energy from the people of Earth (not his own) and even then needs the Dragonballs to recover his energy enough and finally beat Kid Buu. And while he gathered that energy, Fat Buu and Vegeta were the ones doing the water carrying.

So, his accomplishments from the whole of DBZ are: He beats Nappa (Vegeta kills). Beats Vegeta (huge assist from Yajirobe and Gohan). He beats Recoome and Burter (Vegeta kills). Oh and he recovers his body by throwing a frog. He beats Frieza (but Trunks has to finish him off). He beats Kid Buu (massive assist from 6 billion Earthlings, all the Z-fighters, Fat Buu, and a wish from the Dragonballs).

Overall he really doesn't do that much, he's usually travelling, recovering, or dead when the fights are happening. Off the top of my head I count 34 different individuals to fight throughout DBZ (not including the transformations they all go through, just the number of threats to face). And I left out the Garlic filler saga, that would make it 39 threats). Of all these threats, Goku beats just 6 of them, 7 if you count the Ginyu frog thing. Check it yourself if you like. But the fact remains that Goku was NEVER pushed down people's throats in DBZ. It was always believed he was the best, the main hero, but in actual fact the others got a lot accomplished.

Whereas in GT? There wasn't a single meaningful battle that Goku didn't take complete credit for, he literally beat everyone. That was a huge difference to DBZ. And that's the main reason I don't like GT, it wasn't anything like DBZ, and I never wanted Goku to do everything, that's way too predictable, boring, stagnant, it just makes the show linnear and one-dimensional, without much depth or twist to it. In DBZ there were so many different personalities, philosophies, approaches to combat. GT was, as people accurately suggest, Goku Time, owing to the fact that he does everything.

But, that said, I do understand why you might enjoy it, Goku is awesome, the stories did have potential, and maybe you can relate to Pan. Continue enjoying it :). But just don't suggest it's anything like DBZ.

TrueCelt (talk) 15:06, September 12, 2012 (UTC)

DBGT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Edit

First off, I wanna thank you for your colorful history lesson about shit I already knew happened. But don't get it twisted, Dragon Ball GT is not like my all time favorite series of this franchise, I just feel as though people don't like it for selfish reasons. You mentioned the characters being misrepresented, HOW?? Gohan has been changing ever since the end of the Cell saga, doing his Great Saiyaman bullshit, never training, sitting on his ass waiting for his unlocked power to come out that he didn't even use to his full potential! He strong, but he's weak because he doesn't train, he's a family and a business man now so why after the Buu saga should that change? Goten is going on dates now, we know he's strong but 10/10 he doesn't train on his own! Trunks is more mature now from how he was in the Buu saga, he's captain of capsule corp and is a main factor in the series also. How is Vegeta misrepresented? He's older and way more mature than he was in DBZ (which I think is good), yet he's still strong because he trains. Just because he loses to Super 17 doesn't mean shit, out of all the other fighters (Goten, Trunks, Gohan and Majiuub) he was the only one still standing and ready for battle. And Pan, of course she was nice during the end of DBZ, she was a fucking 3 or 4 year old! come on man! She's like 14 in DBGT with the attitude of Videl (when she was a teenager) and Chi-Chi.

Oh, and just a quick note before I jump into this Goku shit, just because any of the other supporting fighters didn't kill of any major villians did you forget about these fights?? Goten vs. Baby, Baby Goten vs. Gohan, Vegeta vs. Baby Gohan & Baby Goten, Gohan vs. General Rildo, the Z fighters vs. Super 17, etc??

Now, with this Goku shit, there is one major factor you forget to include in your history lesson, how everyone depends on Goku, regardless if he was the one pulling the final trigger!!! With the Saiyans, who was everyone waiting and depending on to get there? They even stopped the fight for an hour I believe and WAITED for Goku to show up! When Krillin, Gohan and Vegeta fought the Ginyu force, who were they waiting for to show up?? Especially with Frieza! When everyone heard Goku admit to being weaker than Cell they couldn't believe it!! All hope was lost in their minds if Goku couldn't do it!! The only reason Goku even had to come back to life in the first place to challenge Majin Buu was because EVERYONE else, couldn't do it!!! Gotenks bullshitted around and focused on having a memorable battle instead of going SSJ3 in the first place and finishing the job (Bullshiting!!) Gohan, being super cocky with also a lack of training and battle strategy, toyed with Buu instead of finishing the job like he was supposed to (Bullshitting) So if Gotenks is absorbed, along with Piccolo, Vegeta is dead, along with all of the supporting cast and the human race for that matter! Who else is there to challenge Buu?? Goku!! That's why Old Kai gave him his life and sent Goku back to earth, so he can clean up everyone else's mess! No need to get into Buu's transformations, Vegeta coming back, Vegito, Spirit Bomb and etc! I'm just trying to make a point!!

Now with Buu dead, and Uub as his reincarnation of course Goku is training excessively in the Hyperbolic Time Chamber for years! So he is incredibly strong at the beginning of GT! No one is suprassing him, which is why he's everyone's number 1 go to guy when shit get thick, because let's be real, if Goku was dead or wasn't in the show, motherfucking Baby would have turned everyone into Tuffles and that would be the end of the story!

Like what more could we have gotten out of GT than what was already displayed! Stop being selfish people!

My Reply...(I can't stand making up titles every time)Edit

Okay. So you knew all that "shit" happened? So there's no excuse for forgetting. When you said: "Goku has been everyone's go to guy for battle ever since he was 12 years ago, GT didn't change anything! He's the strongest! Point blank period." you were wrong. I highlighted what I did to make that point, because you were wrong, not to give you a history lesson, but to have the respect for you to show you exactly why you were wrong. I don't disagree out of bias, I disagree because of the facts.

And when you ask how Vegeta, Prince of All Saiyans, a man who values his Pride above his life, the lives of his family, and is utterly defined by his strength, has been misrepresented, that amazes me! Let's start with "a true Saiyan's hair never changes from birth" and the fact he had nothing but disdain for any discussions about vain things, like hairstyles. This was something he grunted out in absolute disgust. And you don't think him wearing leather pants and a camp moustache is misrepresenting him?!? How about Gohan? After the Kai's training, his inner power, that which he was gifted from birth, was unleashed. So why was he unable to use it in GT? Where did that power go? You know, the power that as a little boy he was able to destroy mountains with, without even trying? They just decided to cut that out and make him a regular Super Saiyan again.

I'll let you off with Goten, but Trunks?! Really?!? The guy who grew up to stand up to the Androids on his own? The little boy who would fight Majin Buu to save his daddy, would go anywhere in search of danger and adventure, who wanted to challenge 18, wearing a goofy costume and completely off-balance? That kid just disappeared and became a weak, spineless man? Sorry, that just doesn't happen, not without good reason. His mother was Bulma, his father was Vegeta, and neither of those individuals knew how to be anything other than confident and tough. Trunks was destined to be a confident, strong personality, that would never change. And that's the main problem with GT. They changed all the characters, and expected us not to question it, when the logic and personality had already been set during the DBZ show.

Pan bugs everyone. Or at least anyone that can't stand a spoilt brat. As children, Goku, Goten, Gohan, how were they? Ask yourself that question. The answer is quiet, respectful, a little shy, but with a heart of gold, truly good children. Now look at Pan in DBZ. Do you think Toriyama wanted to do something different with her? Would he have made her such an insufferable brat, based on the Pan we saw then? Videl may have been headstrong and a tough girl, but look how she responded to Gohan's love. She melted, became a soft, kind young lady, and it changed her completely. Why was she tough in the first place? Because Hercule was a clown, never knew how to give her the father's attention she needed, and she had to fend for herself. While being famous at the same time. A lot of pressure. That toughness made sense. But with Pan, she was the daughter of two soft, kind, loving parents, Gohan and Videl. It just does NOT make sense for her to be so appalling.

In response to the fights you mention, maybe you missed my point? Because you only highlight it for me. In all of those fights, did the Z-fighters win a single one? And did they last for longer than a single episode? You know, the way all relevant fights did in DBZ.

And as far as everyone relying on Goku, you're absolutely right, they did. But that's a smokescreen to cover the true facts in DBZ. Just because they were waiting on Goku, and he inspired hope in his friends, doesn't mean he did everything in the show, nor that he was always the strongest. He may have been the hope and inspiration and motivation for those around him, but the reality was far different than their fantasy, he did far less of the work than you might think, if you're caught up in Krillin-hype.

We could have gotten a LOT more out of GT. I'm not asking for it, I'm not selfish, I accept what GT gave us. But I don't accept it being considered equal to DBZ, it's not good enough.

But okay, just for poops and giggles, how about this for a start?

Alright, okay, maaaybe we can't use Vegeta as much, maybe he's hit a plateau and he now needs to be a guiding figure, an extremely stern teacher who demands the absolute best. Shows character development, and he'd be excellent as a critical judge of fighting ability, always expecting more. Piccolo can be another guiding figure, he's a former guardian and proven succesful as a teacher of the martial arts.

What about Goten and Trunks, youngest EVER Super Saiyans? Maybe could they have trained harder, and now they're ready to take on the task of protecting the Earth? What about Gohan? The strongest unfused character in DBZ. He's bound to have progressed as the natural successor to Goku, he now can reach a new level than he previously had when he fought Majin Buu. As for Goku, he's been training Uub this whole time, so he's still just as sharp. And young Uub is a great talent and prospect to help defend the Earth, similar ages to Goten and Trunks. And maybe, just maybe Goku can find something to become that bit stronger than the others. So he's turned into a child by an evil Namekian who lands on Earth with his own Dragonballs. Turns out the Namekian is a relation of Slug, or King Piccolo. He's defeated, but Goku has to travel through space as a child to retrieve the balls. He brings his sweet grand-daughter Pan, who's non-violent like her daddy, but has incredible power, and he also brings his protege, Uub. Perhaps Bulma and Krillin, two people with experience of this type of journey, could come too. It'll only be a year or so, I'm sure 18 would understand, and Bulma is a genius, they'll need her. Or maybe young Bulla is an aspiring scientist like her mother and grandfather, perhaps she could come instead.

Together they travel the galaxy, meet interesting challenges and conflicts, and successfully collect the Dragonballs, after which they wish for Goku to be an adult again. With his new tail, Goku has greater power, and you're set up for the next level, Super Saiyan 4. In space, they encounter aliens like Frieza, the evil overlord who ran the universe through his vast empire and armies. And face interesting characters with unique powers similar to the likes of Ginyu and Guldo. While they're gone, a threat emerges on Earth, leaving its protector, Gohan, to deal with it, with the help of Trunks, Goten and Vegeta. Being the son of Vegeta, Trunks doesn't want to fuse these days, he has too much pride and wants to fight by himself. But then if things really get bad, he and Goten still have the option. A teenage fused Super Saiyan 3.

I'm not going to go any further, but they COULD have made a hell of a lot more out of GT. Better dialogue, take more time over the fights, don't let Goku do everything, allow some significant character development, instead of replacing Puar and Oolong with absolute legends like Vegeta and Gohan and Piccolo. It's not selfish to want something better, when you already know it's possible. If you drive a Ferrari, would you be happy to see it replaced by a Fiat? And to see people saying they're just as good?!? I don't like going from an awesome 200mph to a lousy 120 maximum, and neither do most people, that's why there's huge complaint about GT, and it sure isn't selfish. It's finding genius and refusing to accept less, not being happy with a step backward.

My only true issue here is the idea that GT is as good as DBZ. You can call people selfish for wanting more, if you choose, and like the show if you do, that's fine by me, and all I've done is state my opinions and why I disagree with you. You don't have to agree with me, we can respect each other's points without agreeing on them. But the one thing I'd really like to know above all else, is if you honestly feel GT was as good as DBZ?

TrueCelt (talk) 04:46, September 15, 2012 (UTC)

DBGT Edit

Of course DBGT isn't as good, groundbreaking, memorable, iconic, etc the list goes on as DBZ, there's no question in my mind about that. According to the link supplied about Toriyama's opinion of DBGT, he highly recommends for any fan of his creation to watch the show. He looked over every saga, storyline, characters, etc and it was fine with him, I'm pretty sure if Toei wanted to add in something that Toriyama didn't approve of, then it wouldn't have happened. So technically, people who hate GT, can essentially have a problem with Toriyama too because although he didn't write the script himself, he overlooked every bit of small detail that was displayed in the show.

Now with Gohan, you honestly mean to tell me that he can compete with General Rildo, Baby Vegeta, Super 17 and the Shadow Dragons without proper training?? I can give a fuck about his "ultimate" powers being unlocked, after Buutenks came and went, Gohan was once again outclassed!!! Kid Buu would've beat the shit out of him (regardless of what Gohan fanboys think) and what happened after Buu died?? HE STOPPED TRAINING! He just sat on the same level of power he obtained after Old Kai unleashed them. He married Videl, has Pan as a daughter, a scholar and a family man, training is FAR from his mind. So of course he's no match for GT villians! PERIOD!

To me, on a scale of 1-10, Dragon Ball is a 10/10. Dragon Ball Z is a 10/10. Dragon Ball GT is a 7/10!

Regardless of what flaws, mistakes, misrepresentations or complaints we may have about GT the fact of the matter is it's canon, it happened and we can either chose to love it, hate it, accept it, reject it, watch it or not!

MY reply... Edit

AT helped with designs, gave advice, enjoyed it to an extent, and told fans to treat it as an alternate universe to his work. He wasn't involved with the story, though, just some advice here and there.

I personally don't hate GT the way others do. Some people don't like it because of wierd power match-ups, like Rildo > Buu, Base Goku > SSJ Gohan, etc. That's just people being ignorant, to be honest....no offense to anyone who genuinely hates the series for a good reason, though.

That guy pointed his finger and Kakarot fell down!PrinceVegeta66 22:27, September 15, 2012 (UTC)

it's not even that GT was bad. in fact for not even being written by toriyama himselt the storyline is actually pretty badass in how it was devoloped. i personally didnt like the black star saga or the super 17 saga. but i loved the baby and shadowdragon saga.

the thing with GT its such a roller coaster ride in what they were tyring to do with it. int he black star saga the first 15 episodes were trying to get back intot he feel of dragon ball. with the silly moments and just the theme of adventure. but it doesnt hold upsince DBZ changed eveything in terms of their powers ECT. i mean IIRC goku couldent actually fly till the start of DBZ. meaning in retrospec. there would be no need to keep falling on their asses after instant transmission failed. just catch yourself anf just fly there at that point. but i digress, but little things like that is just plain messed up. i know its little things like that but they really do make a difference. all in al the black dragonball saga just plain out drags. the untill baby is released and starts his reign of terror. dbgt is a plain bore to watch. iirc thats around 20 or so episodes before it got good. i know this is my opinion, but it seems to be a widespread opinion. truth be told the baby and shadow dragon saga i do consider cannon and in their own right are great additions to the whole story of dragon ball. but the super 17 and black star ball saga could easily be omitted.

It was Flawed all the way... Edit

Hmm ... so let me begin with the biggest flaws of dbgt -

- Firstly, it lacked the atmosphere of dbz, where u feel attached to the world of z fighters, it lacked depth most of all the charecter depictions were rather incomplete.

- Vegeta, Gohan, Trunks and Goten these are supposed to be very pivotal in the series have been very much sidelined, its as if dbgt was a goku fantasy tribute. no offense to goku fans but hey, who ever watched dbz would feel downgraded after watching the storylines of gt.

- I liked baby as a villain they way he was created it was a touch of brilliance there, and to some point the hell 17 saga was also gud, nothing much into it apart from these two.

- Goku becoming a kid was the worst part in my view, and the reason i say it is because - Sean Schemmel, its as if Goku lost his voice, i just hate the idea of goku being "permenantly" small" and how the heck can he transfrom back into adult as a SSJ 4 ??

- Vegeta just shows his SSJ 2 strength all the way and dats ridiculous, he has kept training all the time and deserved a SSJ 3 transformation. I can understand dat Gohan has been out of training and hence his strength declines but Goten and Trunks should have been more warrior like, it would have made up for better storylines.

There's not much one can say if these are your personal thoughts, as everyone has their own opinions and are entitled to it. I would like to point, however, that some things you said were inaccurate:

1) Goku wasn't permanently small. The wish caused him to become young again which means, in time, he will grow into an adult again. This is evident in the end of GT where he is an adult again.

2) He becomes an adult again, because SSJ4 breaks any wish granted on the user. It's that powerful.

3) He didn't train as much as Goku and Uub, because of DBZ. It was during the Kid Buu battle that Vegeta finally swallowed his pride and admitted Goku is the the best. This caused him to forget about SSJ3 and beyond seeing as how he has no passion to surpass Goku anymore. Not GT's fault in why Vegeta can't/doesn't try to go SSJ3.

4) Nothing in DBZ suggests Goten and Trunks want to become warriors and infact show that they both have been neglecting their training. Trunks and Goten didn't even want to join the Budokai tournament, but they were forced to. Pan is the one who was supposed to be the next star and that's exactly what GT did. Besides, Toriyama stated in an interview that he loved the idea of Goku being a child again and how it was mostly about Goku and Pan. SuperGogeta91 (talk) 04:31, January 27, 2013 (UTC)

I liked gt Edit

I enjoyed GT but just not as much as dbz. The music, the fight scenes, and the plot were just not as good as dbz. But that doesnt mean it's as bad as people as say it is. Anyway even if toriyama accepted the plot in GT, it's still not based on a plot that he wrote in the manga. So no matter what, it's still technically not canon to manga, but canon to the anime only. I still liked it though--Ssj3gogeta96 (talk) 19:29, January 27, 2013 (UTC)ssj3gogeta96

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