This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Gogeta article.
Broly Being The Strongest Edit
I recently got these infos from Japanese websites and heard some strange talk on Broly being the strongest character in entire DB universe even stronger than Gogeta SSJ4. Well this info says;
This quote kinda means Broly is strongest in 1 on 1, hand to hand battle since nobody even match the strength of Broly in the series and movies therefore Koyama says he is the most fearsome and strongest of all characters in DB series and so on.
And also the DVD guidebook says within TV animation and manga and all the movies Broly's strength is recorded to be the most powerful character that nobody could beat on 1 on 1 battle.
and plus the last part of this quote says Broly's strength is something that cannot be mesured and it is constantly rising and rising.
Based on these infos well Japanese people says Broly is the strongest character who could outclass Gogeta 4 and they fight about these. I personally think Broly can be beaten well by probably SSJ3 level or Ultimate Gohan would do. What do you guys think about this?
- The opinion of Japanese fans is no more official than the opinion of English fans. Unless Akira Toriyama (or as a stretch, perhaps Toei) was one of the ones who commented. -- 21:17, 14 October 2008 (UTC)
I dont know broly is really powerful but i thought hes more powerful then any z warrior in GT/End of Z, except for Piccolo Krillin yanmcha and tien. (Goten.GT1 21:04, 5 November 2008 (UTC))
- Why would he be stronger than every Z fighter except Piccolo, Krillin, Yamcha and Tien? That would mean that Piccolo, Krillin, Yamcha and Tien were stronger than Goku, Vegeta, Gohan, Trunks and Goten - which doesn't seem particularly believable to me. -- 22:32, 5 November 2008 (UTC)
Dekoshu 22:34, 5 November 2008 (UTC) I agree with you there, Nonoitall. SS3 and SS4 can fight Broly.
- Well, Maybe the fans aren't official, but a DVD guidebook (assuming it's made by Toei, Shonen Jump, or Akira for that matter.) seems official enough to exempt Broly.
Gogeta's Speed Edit
In Fusion Reborn, When Gogeta first appears, he is so fast that his attacks can not be seen on the screen by more then just several light lines of color(I can't think of how to describe them) This was used again in GT to show his immense speed when he first appeared, but unlike the first time, when he appeared this time, his attacks were completely invisable, and not even an after-image of his attacks was shown on the screen, and the sheer force of his Punches is causing air to blast forward at enough speed to crush Janemba's Chest inwards(Even Goku at SS3 was unable to do this feat, with a double kick that caused Janemba to double over even at close range) to me, this indicates that Gogeta, in either of his forms, is the fastest Character in the Entire Series. His Power is defeniatly high as well, but his speed seems to be higher then his Counter-part Fusion, I don't want to start an argument about the Fusion Stuff, because I have been in a ton of those, and they degrade into flaming, but the only other character in the series that managed to duplicate his feat of being fast enough to hit someone with the force of a punch without acctually hiting them was Ultimate Gohan, and he was much closer to Super Buu then Gogeta was to Janemba(right next to him compared to Gogeta's several meters). Speed isn't equal to power, so I'm not saying that Gogeta in his base form is as powerful as a SSj4 or anything like that, I am saying that Gogeta is probably the Fastest Character in the series. I can provide more examples as neccesary, but I believe that this fact should be mentioned somewhere on his article, as it shows that, even compared to Gotenks, Vegito, or Ultimate Gohan,or either of the Super Sayian 4s Gogeta seems to outclass each one of those characters in speed by a large Margin, if not in power. We know that Vegito was equal to a Super Saain 3 when he was a Super Sayain, and it can't be considered a stretch to think Gogeta was on that level, but he was much faster then Vegito. 18.104.22.168 21:14, 2 December 2008 (UTC)
19:40, 2 December 2008 (UTC) That's right, humble sir. Gogeta is much faster than Vegito. He has both immense speed and power, and Vegito is also immensely powerful.
While I am not arguing with Vegito's Power, or Gogeta's, I just feel the Article should mention somewhere that he is probably the Fastest Character in the entire DBZ Universe, no matter what Media, in either form (Though his SSj form might be outclassed by some of the stronger GT Characters like Nouva)22.214.171.124 21:14, 2 December 2008 (UTC)
- The after image trick and technique of making a character disappear is only a visual trick used by animators to give the illusion of a character who can move at speeds that are hard to track. This trick is constantly reused, and altered in effect. It is used as a relative comparison to another speed being used, so basically in scene A the animators may make character A use that animation trick, and make character B look slower. While in scene B where they don't use after-image on C, but D uses it. Yet C is actually faster than A in this case. Yet, C had no after-image used.
- Basically after-image, or disappearing characters is completely a visual trick. You cannot derive a fact like 'who is the fastest' out of whether someone uses after-image, disappears, or whatever.
- That kind of thing is complete speculation, unless a canon source actually stated that one character is the fastest in the universe, then information like that has no reason to be on an encyclopedia. ~NOTASTAFF Daniel Friesen (DanTMan, Nadir Seen Fire) (talk) Dec 2, 2008 @ 22:02 (UTC)
22:08, 2 December 2008 (UTC) I agree with you, but isn't that unnecessary to put that in. Some of them are really the most fastest, so I can't just deny it.
- We don't have to put anything in. What Dantman was saying (or at least what I understood) is that we don't have any concrete evidence to support the idea that Gogeta is the fastest character in the universe. (His fast movement in battle is just an effect that doesn't really tell us anything other than he is moving faster than his opponent.) Anyway, we don't need to deny that he's the fastest character. (That too would lack any concrete evidence.) We just can't insert a claim that he is. -- 11:07, 3 December 2008 (UTC)
Then we can't really say that his SSj4 Form is stronger then everyone else in the series (Which is said), because he never Fights Broly, or Hidregun, or Janemba, or even Krillin or Tien, and it could be that he isn't actually stronger then them, it just seems that way because he fights someone so much weaker then him, and, using the same technique that they use on Gogeta in the Movie, is only APPEARING to be stronger the most others 126.96.36.199 19:05, 11 December 2008 (UTC)
- What's written in the article is "His speed in this form is the greatest seen in the series, being so fast not even the viewer can see his movements." That is a 100 percent true, since we as viewers cannot see him moving, while every other character is seen moving, whether it be after-image, hyperspace, or anything else of the sort. But Gogeta clearly isn't. --Dranzer Neos 18:59, 12 December 2008 (UTC)
- And furthermore, saying that SSj4 Gogeta is not stronger than Broly or Hirudegarn or Janemba are, no offense, is just plain stupid. Broly might be a challenge, since his Legendary Super Saiyan form increases his power the longer he stays in that form, so he could prove to be a match if he sticks around for long enough. But Hirudegarn, who was beaten by SSj3 + Dragon Fist, is obviously no match for the Fusion of two Super Saiyan 4s. And Janemba doesn't even come close. If he was beaten by normal Super Gogeta, he doesn't stand a chance against Super Gogeta 4. Same goes for the rest. If they were beaten by weaker forms of the fusees or weaker characters than Gogeta, than they don't compare. That makes it obvious that Super Saiyan 4 Gogeta is the strongest character in the anime series. --Dranzer Neos 20:54, 12 December 2008 (UTC)
- You know, I agree with all of these things except for Broly's LSSJ form definitely being beaten by SSJ4 Gogeta. I mean, we don't really have any real basis that SSJ4 Gogeta is able to defeat LSSJ Broly (especially since they made it quite clear that the two defeats on Broly's part were because of luck, and dumb luck while we are at it.). Heck, for all we know, SSJ4 Gogeta could have just as easily have been beaten to a complete pulp by Broly. That's also the reason why I felt we can't really say that he's much stronger than Super 17 (As a matter of fact, at one point in the Super 17 article, there was a statement that Super 17 was arguably even stronger than Omega Shenron due to his energy absorption skills as well as the fact that he was defeated due to a technicality in regards to his ability rather than by actual skill.). My suggestion, we remove Broly's LSSJ form and Super 17 from those that could be beaten by SSJ4 Gogeta, but we keep it as is (Since, really, it's kinda obvious that he's stronger than the ones on there (Gogeta is Goku and Vegeta's fused form [by Fusion Dance], Ultimate Gohan couldn't even beat Super Buu, whileas only Vegito (another Goku/Vegeta fusion) stood a chance, Baby wasn't able to defeat SSJ4 Goku, meaning he couldn't even lay a finger on SSJ4 Gogeta, Majin Buu won't be able to handle SSJ4 Gogeta if they ever fought, same with Uub/Majuub, and the Fight with Omega Shenron kinda proved who was superior (in fact, had the 15-minute fusion not ran out at 15 minutes, and had SSJ4 Gogeta actually fought seriously, he probably would have flat-out killed Omega Shenron.).).
- The somewhat humorous remark was made a while back that Broly would undoubtedly have been weaker than SS4 Gogeta, as if he wasn't, there would be no point to the Z fighters messing around with fusion and SS4 — they could just get an SS2 and a regular Super Saiyan with spiritual support from their dead dad to defeat the villain. (A reference to Gohan, Goten and Goku, who defeated Broly.) It's not exactly Daizenshuu grade material, but it does make sense in a funny way. Anyway, I don't really care whether Broly's name is there or not. (The exhaustive list of all the characters weaker than Gogeta never seemed that necessary to me.) That's just the reason I never bothered to remove the name myself. :-) -- 10:59, 8 February 2009 (UTC)
- Guys, this whole discussion is pointless. We couldn't see Goku move AT ALL as early as in his fight against Jeice and Burter, and his powerlevel was 90,000 at that point. Does it mean he's faster than his Super Saiyan form, just because we didn't see him do stuff exactly like that in that form? No, he isn't. In the DBZ universe, speed is usually proportional to the power, so the powerlevel is also an accurate indicator of the warrior's speed (with the exception of people who are exceptionally heavy and bulky, like Ultra Super Saiyans). As said before, what we as viewers see doesn't reflect the true speed of the warriors, it's just meant to be RELATIVE. Super Saiyan Gogeta was enough to easily beat Janemba, but we don't know how powerful he was, e.g. whether he was stronger than Ultimate Gohan or even SS3 Gotenks, but if he is, he is also faster. If he's not stronger than them, it also means he's slower, simple as that. Xfing 17:04, February 4, 2012 (UTC)
Hey, I noticed that Gogeta's hair and eyes are denoted by coloured boxes. Could someone please send me a link or something to a page where I can get the codes of those colours? --Dranzer Neos 12:21, 13 December 2008 (UTC)
wouldnt Gogetas base form hair color be red,since that's the color he has at ssj4(ssj4 tranformations uses the original hair color if i'm not mistakin) then again fat gogetas hair was black...something to think about i guess.like it even matters what color his hair is XD188.8.131.52 03:18, 25 January 2009 (UTC) When you look at Vegito's hair it's a mix of black and dark brown, the combination of the colours make the hair seem like a maroon brown which has a hint of red and since Vegito is the Potara counterpart of Gogeta that is possibly why (Nubescout 01:45, 14 April 2009 (UTC)).
Look at this! EditI was just looking at some Dragonball Z pictures and when i saw Gogeta and Vegeto they looked like brothers! Vegerot 19:12, 8 February 2009 (UTC)
Gogeta's power level Edit
I was certain Gogeta's power level in his Super Saiyan state is supremely high. Hirudegarn has a power level. Vegito has a exceedingly high and complex power level. Raditz has a power level, Goku has a power level, and even Gohan has a power level.15:51, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
- Yes, because the series has attributed power levels to those characters; please don't submit unfounded power levels. Storm talk – projects 19:54, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
Facial structure Edit
I'm having trouble coming to an conclusion about who Gogeta resembles because in his Super Saiyan 1 and 4 forms he looks like Goku, but it says that he looks more like Vegeta. --LocC 09 15:12, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
Nevermind, he looks much more like Vegeta only when he has his serious face on. --LocC 09 19:32, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
Galick Kamehameha Edit
I think Gogeta super saiyan can use Galick Kamehameha because no one ever use this attack and it will come in budokai tenkaichi 4.
I think that if Gogeta's basic form is put in the game yet alone if it even comes out then the Gallick Kamehameha should be given to him as his first blast 2 (Nubescout 11:28, 14 April 2009 (UTC)).
- I guess that remains to be seen. -- 07:46, 18 April 2009 (UTC)
Could it be mistaken by Final Kamehameha [EvolutionMaster] 24/May/2009
Is there SSJ4 Gogeta's voice in Blue Water? Edit
Personally, I like FUNIimation's unique cast. Is there a voice actor played SSJ4 Gogeta on GT's Blue Water Dub?22:50, December 8, 2009 (UTC)
Super Saiyan 4 Gogeta - Strongest character in all of fiction? Edit
What do you guys think? SaiyanZ 01:41, February 19, 2010 (UTC)
- Hate to be "that guy", but this topic needs to be moved to a forum. The article talk pages are just for discussing controversial changes. -- .10X.Ka.me.ha.me.ha.....talk.....contrib. 02:32, February 19, 2010 (UTC)
Nah, it's fine, it is actually a benefit since now I know when and where to put topics like these :D. But, I don't know how to move it, can you tell me? Do I just start a new topic over again? SaiyanZ 03:39, February 19, 2010 (UTC)
- Go to forums, Kame House, and then fill in the "Add new topic" bar and click to add it. This will create a forum page about whatever you want. -- .10X.Ka.me.ha.me.ha.....talk.....contrib. 03:44, February 19, 2010 (UTC)
Thank you SaiyanZ 02:50, February 20, 2010 (UTC) WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOH!!!! I WAS HERE!!! :D
Super Saiyan 2?Edit
Isn't he a Super Saiyan 2 in the movie? He has lightnings arround him and look more SSJ2 than an SSJ1, so I think he is a SSJ2 in the Movie--SoranPanoko 16:49, August 9, 2010 (UTC)
- Some people think that,but it's the same way he looks when he's SS1, minus the extra lightning in the aura (which people like Goku have occasionally in base and Super Saiyan form). More importantly, it's been officially stated that Gogeta has no Super Saiyan 2 form. -- 10X.Ka.me.ha.me.ha.....talk.....contrib. 20:57, August 9, 2010 (UTC)
Editing With Ultimate Blast:Edit
- Not sure who you're talking to, but that sounds like a big stretch and not worth having. -- 10X.Ka.me.ha.me.ha.....talk.....contrib. 00:26, June 28, 2012 (UTC)
World Spirit Bomb Edit
About his power level Edit
Look, I know it's not exactly our job to point out how improbable a power level is, and not a lot of people take the V-Jump numbers for Gogeta and Broly seriously (Cooler's is fine though), but come on. We should at least point out on this page that the math doesn't add up. SS3 Goku < Janemba. Gogeta > Janemba. Gogeta: 2.5 billion. Super Saiyan Goku: way more than 470 million (since he beat Cooler). A Super Saiyan 3 is eight times as powerful as a Super Saiyan. So over 470 million x 8 = way over 3.76 billion, meaning Super Saiyan 3 is actually stronger than Gogeta, which obviously isn't true.--184.108.40.206 05:57, March 11, 2013 (UTC)
- We use official sources over original research. Original research (sometimes abbreviated OR) means a fan used logic or math rather than a published statement. That's not to say that your math is bad by any means, just that sometimes anime logic or math is fuzzy and we have to stick with that rather than second guess it. -- 10X.Ka.me.ha.me.ha.....talk.....contrib. 22:20, March 11, 2013 (UTC)